Martinex1: It is our 40th installment of Follow the Leader and we are still going strong! Thanks to all of you who have initiated and kept these conversations rolling. This is one of the most popular and visited features on BitBA and it is because of your creativity and contributions.
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17 comments:
Some Conan The Barbarian questions today:
1) Who was the best Conan artist: Barry Smith or John Buscema (or perhaps some other artist you prefer) ?
2) Which were the best of Robert E. Howard's original Conan stories (assuming you've read any) ?
Also any views on Arnie's Conan or the 2011 re-make or Dark Horse's comic series which has been running since 2003 ? So by Crom, let your opinions spill forth like the entrails on a Hyborian battlefield !
Good questions, Colin.
1) My response is going to be a bit circuitous, but I have to say that initially, I avoided Conan comics because, a) there were no superheroes, and b) I didn't like the way Conan looked - the way he was drawn on covers, mainly by John Buscema, made him look like a mean bully. Later though, a friend got me into reading the Conan books, and at about the same time I came across the pocketbook reprints of the initial issues of Conan, with art by Smith and Kane. I liked Smith's take in particular (Conan looked more "heroic") and started occasionally reading the then current Conan comics, with Buscema's art. Since I was also reading the Conan prose at the same time, I mainly pictured Buscema's version in my head, and that's been the default ever since (that and the images on the paperback covers by Frazetta, which are a bit similar). So my answer is Buscema.
2) I've read them all, but it's been so long since I last read most of them that I honestly can't remember which my favorite was back then. More recently, a few years back, I re-read "Red Nails," so I guess that's my pick.
Haven't read any of the post-Marvel Conan comics, so I don't have an opinion on them. As for the movies, not a fan. I thought Arnie was mis-cast as Conan, and found both of those movies too ponderous and brooding, totally unlike the pulpy adventures in the original stories or the comics. And in both of those, Arnie was almost completely overshadowed by a Jones: James Earl in the first and Grace in the second (I would have totally loved a barbarian movie with her playing the main role). As for the newer one, starring the new Aquaman, I only saw the last part of it on TV a few years ago, and was mostly unimpressed, even though I think Momoa is much better suited to the character than Schwarzenegger.
I recently watched the 1982 Conan film on YouTube and I agree with Edo about Arnie being miscast but I hadn't seen the film for perhaps 25 years and it was better than I remembered. The 1984 sequel, Conan The Destroyer, is also on YouTube so I'll probably watch that before too long. If you mention Conan the Barbarian to a lot of people they think you mean the Arnie films - sadly they've never heard of Robert E. Howard or the Marvel version. I was really looking forward to the 2011 re-make starring Jason Momoa but I was very disappointed and it was a flop anyway so that was the end of any sequels.
I read the first 10 issues or so of the Dark Horse Conan and thought it was pretty good. Liked Cary Nord's art. As a kid I liked Buscema's Conan as a reliably enjoyable book, but thought Barry Smith's Red Nails was spectacular. Later I really enjoyed Savage Sword by Buscema, with inking by DeZuniga, Alcala and Buscema himself. There are a couple of late Buscema tales people may not have seen: Conan the Rogue graphic novel from 1991 (a special project that Buscema worked on for several years), and a Conan miniseries called Death Covered in Gold from 1999, written by Roy Thomas.
I read one Robert E. Howard collection of Conan stories about 15 years ago, but I don't remember anything about it.
As for the comics, well, John Buscema rules.
I actually read a smattering of his issues with Roy Thomas that were very cool, but years later, when I was tiring of superheroes but still focused on Marvel, I decided to pick up a few Conan the Barbarians for the first time in years, and it was near the end of the James Owsley/Buscema run, and I thought it was great. Then I picked up some Conan the King and that was cool, too (right around the "Prince Conn is dead" arc). All a long-winded way of saying that Conan comic book stories have had a good track record over long swaths of time, even beyond those classic Roy Thomas years.
-david p.
I have one of those little full color pocket sized paperbacks reprinting some early Marvel Conan stories that I bought back in the 70's, but beyond that I never really got into Conan much. The people who are into it seem to really love it, but it was never my thing.
I do appreciate Barry Windsor Smith's artwork though.
I also liked the first Conan movie with Ahhhhnold quite a bit. But every other Conan movie since then has pretty much blown. IMO.
I prefer John Buscema's version of Conan to Windsor-Smith's, but Windsor-Smith's version in "Red Nails" is very good, too. His version improved a lot over his years drawing the character, but when I close my eyes, it's Buscema's that I see.
My favorite Conan REH story is "Beyond the Black River." I have read that story so many times, including a couple of years ago. "Red Nails" would be 1-A. There were a couple of paperback collections in the 70's that included both of those stories, and I had both of them.
I read a couple of the Dark Horse series, the early ones (Conan and Conan the Cimmerian) and a few of the mini-series. I enjoyed those almost as much as Marvel's version. I'm just glad there are efforts to keep him going in comics.
I wasn't that big a fan of Arnold's Conan movies....he was big and muscular, but really too much so and he's sort of wooden as an actor. I did like the recent movie a lot and thought they came closer to the original REH vision of the character.
I lie Buscema's art on Conan; Ernie Chan did some good stuff too, though he was mostly known for Kull.
I agree with Red Nails being a great story; Rogues in the House is good too, but my favourite is probably Tower of the Elephant. It was the first of the original stories I read and I still love it. Great mix of action, magic, and esoteric weirdness.
Favourite Conan story: "Red Nails."
Favourite Conan artist: Barry Smith, even though Buscema's Conan is more like I imagine him to be when I read the original stories. Smith brought an elegance to the tales that I suspect is a million miles away from what Howard intended but I love it regardless.
The first Conan artist I encountered was Gil Kane. Then Smith and the Buscema/ Alcala team.
The Belit Years of the colour comic are probably my
favourites.
While Beyond the Black River is probably the best-written story, I am very keen on People of the Black Circle.
As I have said before, I never was a Conan follower and know very little. I will say that I obviously appreciate the John Buscema art but I always thought that the B. W. Smith cover for the very first issue is just beautiful. The colors and the action and the pose for the debut is just perfect to me; I never owned that book but I like looking at it on line.
I also want to comment that Marvel had an incredible run with Conan - for an "off -brand" item, it still ran 275 issues, plus Giant-Size, plus "King Conan" etc. It must have been very solid and I regret a bit that I always avoided the book. I picked up Team America before Conan - and I am sure that was probably the wrong choice.
I am curious why people did not like the Arnold movies. Again knowing so little, I thought he looked the part. What am I missing in terms of story and characterization? I've only seen a few short scenes though.
Were there ever any Conan toys? It seems like a concept ripe for action figures, and snakes, and castles, and villainous lairs, etc. Did those exist?
I did like Conan's appearances in What If. Cheers on the topic today!
Gents:
I did read a few Conan stories about 10 years ago, in my mid-40s. Bran, Mak Morn and another in a compilation. I found them to be entertaining but there were occasions when I could not understand what the author was trying to describe for a few paragraphs.
Barry Smith is my fav artist. I seldom bought Conan but he enticed me to buy the ones I did. I do remember buying Avengers 100 off the spinner in summer of '72 and thinking "everyone looks like Conan" lol b/c Smith drew it.
I enjoyed the movies. Caught them channel surfing. I was not watching with the intent of critiquing... just a little brain candy... so it was all good!
My opinion: Conan books like the old $1 B&W mags are really fairly cheap if you are patient on ebay... maybe a few $ / issue if you buy a quantity. Go buy a dozen and enjoy! I did that very thing at a Comicon a few years back where I tend to hunt for things I've never read before. It was worth it.
I did think about getting the newer Conans from Dark Horse. Didn't like the coloring so didn't buy any. Just didn't look right to me. But that's just my opinion. Cheers all.
The only reason I started picking up Conan in the first place was to get the Marvel Value Stamps (so the gimmick worked, in this instance). But I soon got hooked, and followed his adventures until about issue 120. Artistically, I prefer Barry Windsor Smith, but Buscema is excellent as well. Conan had the benefit of some fine artists, actually. Some other great teams were found in Savage Tales and Savage Sword- for instance, a gorgeous Gil Kane/Neal Adams story in Savage Tales 4 or 5.
I've never seen any of the films, though, and never read any of the books. Just the comics. I should rectify that sometime.
Martinex, re: Team America v. Conan. As someone who has read both, I can say unequivocally - definitely the wrong choice.
My problem with the Conan movies, the Arnie ones, are - as I noted above - that they take themselves way too seriously. The first one has that long origin sequence, as though we really need to know what motivates Conan, plus that "you killed my father" plot-line. And throughout both movies, Conan, as portrayed by Arnie, is so solemn and humorless. Contrast that to the guy in Howard's original stories or in the comics, who laughed, joked and partied between battles and adventures. He wasn't consumed by the need to avenge his dead parents or something, he was an swashbuckler and mercenary, pure and simple. And he hated magic and sorcerers not because of some childhood trauma, but just because - no explanation needed.
OK I loved Barry Windsor-Smith's version of Conan but for me at least the definitive version is Big John's, preferably inked by either Ernie Chan or Tony DeZuniga. It's funny - my first encounter with the Conan character is the Marvel version; I still have a collection of issues from the late 70s with Roy Thomas, Buscema and Chan at the helm. Only much later did I read the original Robert E. Howard pulp stories which inspired the comicbooks.
I'm a Schwarzenegger fan too but the Conan movies were a world away from the swashbuckling pulp hero as envisioned in the novels. Somehow, and I think I've mentioned this before in previous posts, I believe that Howard conceived Conan as more of a brave Prince Valiant type character instead of the savage uncultured barbarian killing machine we see in popular culture.
- Mike 'barbarian in training' from Trinidad & Tobago.
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