Martinex1: Let me start off by saying, what Redartz and I are about to review is not a great comic. It cannot be classified amongst the masterpieces by Lee and Kirby, or the seminal work by Claremont and Byrne, or the darker stories by Frank Miller, or any of the Bronze Age top 100. But this issue and title remain one of my all-time favorites partially because it fit into a very nostalgic memory from my youth and partially because it is just good-old-fashioned Marvel fun from the middle of the 1970s.
MTIO was not always a powerhouse book; it struggled finding a style and an audience. It probably hit its peak around the Project Pegasus arc with masterful storytelling and art by George Perez and John Byrne. The earlier chapters were lesser works often with simple concepts and standard execution. Heck, the first issue of the series hinged on Ben being upset that a swamp monster would dare be called "Man-Thing" thus chipping away at his cultivated identity as the Thing.
But I digress. The issue in hand is MTIO #26 starring the Thing and Nick Fury, Agent of S.H.I.E.L.D. I first picked up this very minor gem in one of those three-pack poly bags at the local Jewel-Osco when I was around age nine. Much of my end of the review is seen through that prism of early collecting. The book was cover dated April of 1977 and was scripted by Marv Wolfman with art by Ron Wilson and inks by Pablo Marcos. It is the first part of a two-part story and it contains a handful of my favorite characters.
Redartz: This book falls into that large category of comics I read once, when purchased off the stand, and then never read again. Upon reading it now, it almost seems like a brand new experience (for good or ill, there is nothing about the book that stuck in my memory).
Martinex1: When I ripped into the package four decades ago, this book was the middle issue sandwiched between an Amazing Spider-Man and the Invaders. I couldn't believe that the Thing and Nick Fury had their own book. I was not worldly enough to understand the team-up concept, but I was familiar with both characters as they had been shared with me in various forms in comics I received from a dear cousin.
Redartz: My first thought: the cover is a little weak in my opinion. It seems a bit cluttered, with the logo filling nearly half of the cover, then all the glass shards, and background buildings, and word balloons. The Grand Comic Book Database credits the cover to Wilson and inker Frank Giacoia. Another case of “maybe a different inker." And perhaps a solid background would have more clearly (and starkly) framed the falling Fury.
Martinex1: I had a different impression and liked the frantic and frenetic nature of the cover. When I was young I knew of the Thing of course from the Fantastic Four, and I found Nick Fury fascinating as I followed his earlier career in the Howling Commandos and in books like Strange Tales and guest appearances in the Avengers.
Redartz: Writer Marv Wolfman has a good feel for the characters and their voices. One odd thing I noticed, Ben Grimm and Nick Fury have very similar speech patterns; their dialogue could almost be interchangeable. Perhaps that stems, partially, from their shared wartime experience and rough-and-tumble personalities. It makes sense they would have a certain level of friendship
Martinex1: The two headliners are rather similar; both are hard as nails WWII vets who enjoy a cigar and don't mind telling it like it is. Not surprising that they would be friends. They meet in a cute scene in which Ben is chowing down on his fourth pizza when Nick and his sidekick Dum Dum Dugan appear in the pizza parlor and together they ride the counter stools down to a secret S.H.I.E.L.D. lair. Nick has come to inform his friend that his name has come up in some recent espionage around a couple of career criminals.
Redartz: The story does have numerous humorous (say that three times fast!) touches, appropriate for a title starring the ever-lovin' blue-eyed Thing. From the pizza parlor opening onwards, the tone is one of lighthearted action; building to a more dramatic level towards the end.
Martinex1: I enjoyed the schematic supplied of the layout beneath the pizza shop. Those were little tidbits Marvel would employ from time to time that I would pour over. Redartz: I agree; those diagrams were helpful to the reader, especially one who may have been less than familiar with S.H.I.E.L.D.
Martinex1: The big-bads of this piece are the duo of Fixer and Mentallo. The villains were lower level science and ESP agents tied to HYDRA who planned a S.H.I.E.L.D. coup way back in Strange Tales 142 and 143 (the tale was reprinted in Nick Fury, Agent of S.H.I.E.L.D. #18). I was aware of that ancient story as it was amongst the first comics gifted to me. The villains have an interesting relationship and dichotomy. The Fixer "can make anything out of anything" as Fury describes it. And Mentallo is a low-level telepath and manipulator who is enhanced by some of the Fixer's gadgets. They have both broken out of their prisons and clues reveal they have their eyes set on Ben Grimm.
Redartz: I vaguely remember the Fixer and Mentallo from those Strange Tales issues years ago, but like the subject book today, it's been too long to recall much. The threat they posed seemed minimal at first, but Wolfman reveals the master plan slowly, and it effectively surprised this reader at the finale. And the two villains do make a rather effective team...
Martinex1: The creeps set out to capture the Thing but for what purpose is left unsaid. They fly on futuristic disks up to the Helicarrier and cut a hole in its hull with a cold light torch in order to infiltrate the vessel. They are fully aware Ben and Nick are on board.
Martinex1: The villains use servo-pods, dastardly devices that latch to the faces of the victims and turn their minds and bodies over to the control of Mentallo. Fixer and Mentallo manage to hook these devices to a herd of S.H.I.E.L.D. agents as well as the Thing, putting them in the driver's seat. I liked that the pods were modifications of a device that Fixer once employed against Nick Fury, but were further designed for more aggressive use. Hey, if it works why change it?
The gang heads back to the Baxter Building, with a mind-wiped Thing still in tow, and attempt to activate Dr. Doom's time machine (man, this issue has everything and a box of cats)!
Redartz: I didn't see the Dr. Doom time machine use coming. And the Fixer's face-grasping devices were painful to watch in action, but were memorable weapons. I did wonder, though, two things:
1) Mentallo referred to a vision from Spider-Man; can't for the life of me think of what he's talking about. Obviously there was some appearance I missed somewhen.
2) How did the Fixer know to summon Deathlok, of all people, from the future? Granted, that bit of plot may have been revealed in the next issue. I'll take that on faith.
Martinex1: I think both of your questions could have been cleared up with an editorial caption box for that panel and statement by Mentallo. Spidey met Deathlok in Marvel Team-Up #46 just about a year prior. Mentallo picked up on that knowledge from Spider-Man, though the hero himself forgot his travel to the future. That tidbit is a big clue to the final splash page, so maybe they left the note and detail out on purpose. Avid readers of the titles may have intimated what was to occur.
Speaking of that, Marv Wolfman throws so much comic background, action history, and character quirks, into the dialogue that it was easy to jump into this issue. In the first pages Ben and Nick's discussion not only establishes their character timelines and relationships but within twenty or so panels establishes the details of S.H.I.E.L.D. workings but also the motivations and the escape processes of the villains. I commend the way Wolfman packed this issue; he even included the mailman Willie Lumpkin in the Baxter Building scene.
Redartz: Thanks for the clarification there, Marti! Makes more sense now. And the inclusion of Willie Lumpkin was a very nice touch. Good to see some elements from the mainline Fantastic Four book included in MTIO, from time to time.
Redartz: Thanks for the clarification there, Marti! Makes more sense now. And the inclusion of Willie Lumpkin was a very nice touch. Good to see some elements from the mainline Fantastic Four book included in MTIO, from time to time.
Martinex1: I thought Ron Wilson really carried his weight here. Some of the facial expressions and frowns are distinctively in Wilson's style, but the action and layouts were well rendered. I really like the scenes with Fixer and Mentallo floating on the disks and taking down the many guards. I also liked the dynamic nature of Nick Fury taking charge in the floating headquarters. And I think that Wilson pencils a nice Thing, very consistently portraying the difficult-to-draw character.
Martinex1: Hah! I never noticed that. I thought Pablo Marcos was okay here. He keeps some of his scratchy and shadowy inking in moderation. But I have to say that I think issue #26 is much better than part two in issue #27. It looks like an entirely different art team there (and not in a good way). Marcos' inks definitely overtake the pencils in the next issue.
Redartz: My impression of the art, kind of like the story. is that it is generally solid, really sharp in places, and a bit off in others. I enjoy Ron Wilson's pencils, but Pablo Marcos perhaps isn't the best inker for him. It may be the printing, or just my copy, but the art seemed a bit muddy in places. I really liked the panel of the Fixer and Mentallo flying their discs over the snowy peaks (seen above); it had a bit of a Jack Kirby / John Buscema feel. Also the last page appearance of Deathlok was nicely depicted. On the other hand, occasionally Ben's look is somewhat askew. In this panel, it looks like his eyebrow ridge is coming loose.
When I first saw that futuristic nightmare I was blown away. A weird cyborg with an American flag patch and a couple of rayguns - surely Nick Fury and Ben Grimm were in for some trouble! Great way to leave me hanging - the heroes were no better off than when they started the adventure; in fact they now had three formidable villains to face instead of just two.
Again I have to give Marv Wolfman credit. I definitely got at least 30 cents worth of reading in and he had me begging for the next issue (unfortunately that issue would turn out to be a huge letdown on so many fronts). And with the final splash of the first chapter Ron Wilson and Pablo Marcos delivered a punch (and I do say that in the final splash Marcos complimented Wilson well). I do admit, as I stated above, that nostalgia has bumped up my appreciation of this book.
Martinex1: The Good: The first issue is packed with good characterizations, funny banter, and the best use of some B-Level thugs in Fixer and Mentallo. Both Nick Fury and Ben Grimm seem spot on; their interaction is priceless and they should be teamed like this more often. The art is good and dynamic with plenty of detail thrown in.
Redartz: The Good: The story reveal. I really was impressed how the plot details were eked out bit by bit, and by Wolfman's obviously thorough knowledge of the characters' backstories.
Martinex1: The Bad: What happened in the follow-up issue #27? Everything went wrong in the conclusion. Maybe too many ideas were crammed into too few pages. But at the very least they could have had Fury participate a bit more.
Redartz: The Bad: Not bad, per se, but the art did seem to me to suffer some clunkiness at times.
Martinex1: The Ugly: Deathlok! As Ben says, "Cripes! He's even uglier than me!"
Martinex1: The Ugly: Deathlok! As Ben says, "Cripes! He's even uglier than me!"
Redartz: The Ugly: I cringe upon imagining the Fixer's control devices clamping on my face!
Martinex1: So Redartz any final thoughts on this foray into Two-In-One territory?
Redartz: The story is decent overall; a pretty typical mid-level Bronze Age comic. Another half hour enjoyably spent with a couple old friends.
Martinex1: So there you have it! And for all of the BITBA readers out there - what were your memories of this story or MTIO? Do you find the series to be a nostalgic favorite? Did it hold up well over the years? And where does the Thing place in your pantheon of hero classifications?
Cheers! And until Marvel reinvigorates the team-up, make mine BITBA!
19 comments:
Hi All! Never read these issues but I DID read all above! I am strongly reminded of FF of the 3parter FF series culminating in FF 43, the classic "Lo there shall be an Ending!" The Wizard and Frightful4 had mentally manipulated Thing to attack the FF. There is an oddly profound scene of Thing waking up and crushing a telephone! Beautiful! (Sorry Edo...)
This is a difficult topic for me. I guess MTIO was more of my post-initial collecting phase, so I didn't give it as much love as some other start-up titles.
To start, Spidey's MTU was such a nice 'secondary book' for Spidey, before the onset of Spectacular and other tertiary titles. I liked the early Gil Kane art, and also liked the idea of having some continuing characters in the team-up book (like the longshoreman in issue 13..), just kinda poppin' up out of nowhere for a bit of lightness to sort of shape a distinct identity in contrast to the heaviness of ASM back then. I stayed with MTU from ish 12 to about the mid-twenties until prices started going up.
As for MTIO, I liked it's inception in Marvel Feature with Starlin drawing issue's 11 and 12, then having the DD/BW/Black Spectre run through it in MTIO 3, Cap with the Guardians and the Badoon story after that, etc. But after the first half-dozen stories, it just seemed too rushed too soon after it's inception, and a terribly drawn Ben Grimm didn't hold my interest at all, frankly. I believe Wundarr was a good attempt to establish it's own set of characters, so they seemed to be on the right track initially.
Essentially, I liked the idea of a new team-up book weaving itself into other storylines early on until it can reach the point of being it's OWN book, establishing it's own identity. As in the case of MTIO, it did later on with some good 3-parter stories and reasonable art, but by then folks like me seldom gave it a second look.
Another aspect of 'lost opportunities' was Ben's portrayal in MTIO just wasn't interesting to me. For MTU (at least early on..), you could still have some Peter Parker/Spidey angst in it to fill some pages, whereas you'd assume Ben's 'I'm-an-ugly-monster' attitudes could have been used for some foundational drama between fights; it made his portrayal so effective in the FF title back in the Silver days and the emotional heaviness was brought back very well in the two Marvel Feature issues. Once MTIO started, there was typically no FF team members to play off of in the background, nor anything more than wisecracks.
Sorry for going slightly off-topic, but it's kind of 'my angle' on the MTIO title.
David_b, you make some interesting and valid points about MTIO particularly around supporting characters and Ben’s depiction. I think there are a couple of things that they started to get right around this time and I think peaked in and around the Project Pegasus storyline through the Starhawk/Warlock/Moondragon arc. First I think Ben started to come into his own; he wasn’t just the comic relief strongman who followed Reed’s guidance and wallowed in self-pity as part of the FF. My impression was that aspect was getting a little long in the tooth and a little introspection went a long way. Instead in MTIO, Ben became more confident, more inventive and creative, and more of the tough confidant to other heroes. I liked that progression. It became even more apparent when a supporting cast crystalized with Quasar, Ben Foster/Giant-Man, and other poker playing buddies. I liked that he didn’t run to the FF every time a major foe was encountered like Deathlok (again) and the Nth Man. But he didn’t shy away from the team either like in the issues with Mr. Fantastic, the Inhumans, and Maelstrom. Some newer writers like Ralph Macchio and Mark Gruenwald used the lesser known characters to help depict Ben as the veteran hero who was pretty good at mentoring and guiding. But it did take a while for that to evolve. There was still pathos and angst, but Ben accepted his condition a bit more. The writers seemed to have a fair amount of freedom in that. And George Perez and John Byrne’s run of issues didn’t hurt. Although I think Wilson and Jerry Bingham and others did well for the most part, I do understand that this is a second tier book and that few earth shattering storylines would occur within; I actually ended up enjoying those smaller stories. It did however really take a down turn in the series’ last 20 or so issues. Those really stretched to be even a third-tier book with simplified art (limited backgrounds), one issue storylines, and rushed characterizations. The series really went in waves as you pointed out – with early arcs being interesting as well. MTU had its ups and downs too; I’m less confident on which series is better. What I find interesting (and david_b alluded to this) is that the nostalgia for my early days of collecting really colors my opinion of the books and their validity. David, as he said, was winding down a bit more as MTIO evolved so has less interest. I cannot deny that MTIO #26 was one of the first five books I ever purchased and that alone impacted me on the book and the series.
Didn't have this issue, either, so thanks for the rundown, gentlemen. I will say, though, based on the images you posted here, that the art looks pretty solid. I'm not the biggest fan of Wilson's art all the time, but it can be pretty nice when paired with the right inker, and in this case I think Marcos is a good fit (so I don't agree with you about that, Redartz).
As to your questions about MTIO in general, I have very fond memories of the series, and some of the stories I've gone back to re-read since (the initial dozen issues, then #50, 51, the Project Pegasus story and a few others) held up quite well for me. Like Marvel Team-up, it provided some nice, solid entertainment most of the time, and sometimes had some really outstanding stories.
Great points, Martinex1 and thanks for keeping in mind my vantage point. Always loved team-up books but as mentioned, it did come a bit after my initial wave of collecting. I do recall opening the page of a few MTIO's and seeing dismal Ben Grimm art early on, so I'd put it back on the rotating comic stand and hunt down other favorites.
It kinda depended on who the guest-star was perhaps, but also just how far my measly pocket change would go especially with my other devoted titles (CA&F, Avengers, DD/BW, ASM, etc..) and rising prices. :)
Looking back, I do agree that MTIO served nicely to expand Ben's group of acquaintances, and to open up his personality a bit. The periodic poker games were an engaging glimpse into the various characters' private ' off the clock' time. And the book also helped develop some background support. In Marvel Team-up, we were treated to occasional appearances by Peter Parker's supporting cast. Ben never had that so much as part of the FF...
David_b, you make another great point about the guest stars driving the purchase. I couldn’t agree more. While Skull the Slayer, Golem, Scarecrow, or the Blue Diamond may have been somebody’s favorite, they were not mine. The guest was always the initial factor on the purchase; even Wundarr /Aquarian (because I didn’t know who he was at the time) didn’t get me to buy even in the midst of a great story. In fact I didn’t get those issues until much later.
I often wonder how much the team-up titles were used a) to try out lesser characters and see if they had sales legs and b) to finish storylines from other titles. I have to believe on a title like MTIO the sales stats were all over the chart month-to-month.
First of all, I enjoyed reading your joint review! It was nice to "hear" your voices. MTIO was not a book I ever bought regularly. I did pick up most of the Project Pegasus issues, but I remember seeking them out at a con, probably within a year of publication. Back in those days of going to the variety stores after school, I was very picky about adding a new title to my collection. MTIO too often featured characters whom I did not know, (Modred the Mystic? Brother Voodoo? Jack of Hearts?) or in whom I was not interested (Man-Thing, Skull the Slayer, Hulk ). There was always some other book that was going to claim any extra 35 cents I had! I left a lot of good comics on the racks back then!
MTIO, much like MTU, is perhaps a more interesting book to me now than it was at the time. Like pefectly preserved capsules these books seem to carry the essence of the Bronze Age.
New BA characters as guest stars? CHECK
Dabs of BA niche themes (horror comes esp. to mind)? CHECK
A lot of story-per-book? CHECK
A cohesive Marvel Universe? CHECK
The issue(s) at hand show some of these qualities - I own them but have not read them (yet). Art-wise, Ben is drawn well but I have issues with Sue. It's almost as if Ron Wilson is trying to channel Kirby and not getting it quite right.
The story sounds like it has a 60s vibe with both heroes and villains embedded in that era. Not groundbreaking perhaps, but good solid four-color fun.
Thanks for the review, I esp. enjoyed the scene-setting and your context as readers.
Like david_b, I always preferred MTU to MTIO, I guess because Spidey is my favourite Marvel character. But I like Ben Grimm too; his sense of humour is different from Spidey's, but it works. I never cared much about Deathlok ... future characters don't do much for me.
Wasn't there an issue of MTIO where Ben is playing poker with Nick Fury, Captain America, Carol Danvers, and a couple of others? I think it was years after this one, late 70s or early 80s; I always liked that one, since we got to see the heroes in their "downtime".
Mike Wilson
Hiya,
To me books like Marvel Two-In-One and Team-Up were ones that drifted in and out of my reading zone. Because of their nature, a sort of peripheral also ran to the main characters regular book, there had to be something special about the story for me to pick up the book. Otherwise, it stayed on the rack and I moved on. Eventually, with both of them, especially after the Thing went solo, I never came back.
That said, both books did have a charm to them. Especially when two characters who I could not imagine sharing the same space appeared together (Son of Satan and the Thing leap to mind) and had a kinda awkward and brief encounter.
To me, both books were bellwether titles, if the stories were readable then the rest of the titles published by Marvel were, at the very least, decent reads. Which is a conditioned not to be despised. Shooter has repeatedly stated that prior to and during his early years at Marvel that there was a tier system to the books as they were regarded in office. Or in other words, A level titles got A level talent while C level titles got C level talent.
One can only imagine how 'C' level talent came to regard those editors who made it clear that they were considered third raters.
It's sad that some creatives never quite realized that a good, decent comic book was not to be dis-pared but rather valued. For me a title that swung wildly between excellent and lame was to be avoided while a consistent book usually found it's way into my collection.
Seeya
pfgavigan
Hiya,
Hey Mike Wilson, you were quite right. Marvel Two-In-One 51 had the concept of heroes having a running poker game that was interrupted by a call to arms. A solid story by Peter Gillis, Frank Miller and Bob MacLeod.
Seeya,
pfgavigan
As many have said, I was in and out of both of these books. I'd say, though, that over the course of my first buying phase I had more MTUs than MTIOs. And it's funny -- although a regular buyer of Batman and Detective, and of Superboy, I never purchased Brave and the Bold or DC Comics Presents.
Also as others have said, these sorts of books could be really hit and miss. I think that the basic story form was the one-off contributed mightily to that. Although some characterization/event fall-out could be carried forward, it generally was not. Nor was that any type of focus on the part of the creators (as varied as the books' guest-stars).
But I have to say, when I was but a wee lad these team-up books could often almost yank a quarter out of my hand. Spider-Man and the Beast? Uh huh. And back on the BAB I cried out with my love for MTIO #7 with Valkyrie, the Executioner, and the Enchantress. That cover did indeed make me buy that comic book.
Doug
Hey Kids! Comics! Now that I have your attention...lol! I've heard reference to the Pegasus story line several times but knyzip about it. What issues are this? Least expensive way to read it? Regards.
Mike W., as PFG said, you're thinking of MTIO #51 - here's a brief review of it back from the prehistoric days at BAB :P
Charlie, the Project Pegasus story ran from MTIO #53 through 58. If you're interested in learning more about it, Doug and Karen did an outstanding 6-part review of the entire story over at the aforementioned Bronze Age Babies. Here's a link to the first review, and just follow the links at the end of the post for the rest.
By the way, I forgot to mention above that I also love those layout diagrams like the one of the SHIELD secret facilities under the pizzeria. I there was also a cool one of the Project Pegasus facilities when that story was running in MTIO.
Project Pegasus runs from MTIO #53 -58. Written by Gruenwald and Macchio. Pencils by Byrne and Perez. Joe Sinnott and Gene Day ink it. It has guest stars including Quasar, Giant-Man, Thundra, Deathlok and a variety of villains from Klaw to Nuklo. It is in a few trades. You can usually still get reader copy floppies at a reasonable price
Edo, Martin - THanks a million. I'll read the links and then see if I get me some "floppies." (I need to build up some reasons to go to the Chicago Comiccon or C2E2, since admission is sinful at $50 /day in my mind.) Wow - Klaw! That's a blast from the past! Last time I saw him was in FF # 119 (?) which had Thing, Torch (a veritable MTIO!), and the Black Panther in prison and fighting Klaw? Well, it was 45 years ago... I need to break out the long box and refresh my memory with the floppy! And I'll be savoring the text too: Letters columns, Stan's Soap Box, etc.! Hey - Doesn't Thing crush Klaw's sonic do-dad like he crushes that telephone in FF 43 "Lo There Shall Be an Ending!!!. There's way too many coincidences going on today...
I think Ben Grimm is my favorite comic book character (along with Batman--what a team-up that would make!) so I can understand Marvel giving him more playing time on the field, so to speak.
These team-ups weren't always successful, mind you, but with the Thing you could expect a lot of humor and pathos, and clobberin'.
Sometimes the more mismatched they were, the better! Ben had this attitude when confronted with cosmic weirdness that always slayed me--mild sarcasm.
Maybe that's something that Kirby got from the war.
M.P.
Yeah, the teamup aspect of books like MTIO and MTU were the main reason for reading these titles for me at least. Where else would you get Mrs. Grimm's ever-lovin' blue eyed baby teaming up with characters like Moondragon, Man-Thing or Shang Chi (I think I still have that ish!)?
- Mike 'Marvel shoulda done a MTIO w/Ben & Howard the Duck!' from Trinidad & Tobago.
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