Redartz: Wow, almost a month into the new year and we haven't let the Leader out of the box! It's been awhile, so for the benefit of anyone new to the routine , here's the deal:
The first commenter to check in gets the honor of naming the topic for the week! We're all pretty easygoing here, so the subject matter is wide open. Comics or film, music or popular culture, dinosaurs or dragons; it's up to you, You, the one sitting there with a hot topic on your mind. We know, you've been holding it in memory for weeks. Well, now's your opportunity. BitBA Assembled awaits...
20 comments:
A few days ago I watched the Beatles' film 'A Hard Day's Night' for the first time but I've still never seen 'Help!' and I've been intending to read Isaac Asimov's Foundation Trilogy since I was 12 but it's still on my to-do list. Are there any classic films you've never seen but would like to at some point or any classic books you'd like to read one day?
That's a big ask, Colin. Right now I have "Eyes Without a Face" and "A Bridge Too Far" in queue. I just need to sit down and watch them. Not the most challenging fare, but I've so far managed to avoid every previous opportunity to watch them. As for reading, I've never read all of Proust, and while I believe it would be pleasant, I have a hard time imagining myself relaxed enough for long enough to enjoy it as I should. Other than that, I've been thinking about Solzhenitsyn and The Gulag Archipelago mainly because even though I work in academia, I've never met anyone who has read all of it. So there's some street cred involved in the doing.
Cheers!
Colin - Great question!
Book wise I keep meaning to read Dune but can't get past page 20 or so due to the whole "drug" thing (tried at least 4 times in the last 20 years. Even packed if for my intended deployment to Iraq).
But with the massive growth in the use of very mildly psychedelic mushrooms for treating mental illness (I'm dead serious and investing a lot in these companies' stocks) I think I will now be able to read Dune.
I do recommend Asimov's Trilogy. Need to read a bit to get the feel for the style of writing.
No movies on the list! But when I walk into my library I go nuts and always check out the same few to re-watch but never do. Notably, I check out musicals: Fred Astaire - Ginger Rogers, West Side Story, Singing in the Rain, American in Paris... and just never put them in the DVD player. Silly of me, I know.
Oh man, there are tons of "classics" I've never seen/read: Schindler's List, Dr. Zhivago, Cabaret ... for books, I haven't read a lot of the old classics (Moby Dick, Oliver Twist), not to mention classic SF like Dune, Stranger in a Strange Land, Foundation. For comics, I still haven't read Miller's Dark Knight stuff ...
Yeah, I know, I need to turn in my geek card.
No matter how much you read, you always realize there's so much more stuff you want to read, as well as stuff you should read. If I thought about it, I could probably come up with quite a list of books that either one or both of those categories. To keep it simple, I'll just note one work considered a classic by many that I'd like to get to someday: Mervyn Peake's Gormenghast Trilogy.
As for movies, again, tons of stuff I haven't seen that I should probably get around to watching. One that always comes to mind is "A Streetcar Named Desire" - just because I want to see the scene with Marlon Brando shouting "Stella!" that's referenced so much elsewhere.
Thing about me is that my tastes tend to run to ‘Pulp’. Most of the books and movies in my library fall into escapist genres : Mystery, Crime, Horror, Fantasy, Science-fiction. Very little of it is ‘Literary’. I’ve read no Dickens, Steinbeck, Hemingway or Melville (though I’ve been tempted to read MOBY DICK). WUTHERING HEIGHTS and PRIDE AND PREJUDICE are probably the most ‘Classic’ books that I’ve read. I got about 50 pages into JANE EYRE and had to give up. Just too much misery.
Film-wise, I do want to see more Kurosawa movies — I’ve only seen KAGEMUSHA, YOJIMBO and THE SEVEN SAMURAI, and that was at least twenty years ago. Haven’t seen ANY films by Fellini, Truffaut, Godard or Bergman. I’ll likely go to my grave without ever having seen 8 1/2, THE SEVENTH SEAL, LA JETTE and SHOOT THE PIANO PLAYER...and honestly, I’m perfectly OK with that.
Crime pictures on my bucket list: TREASURE OF THE SIERRA MADRÉ, POSTMAN ALWAYS RINGS TWICE, CHARLEY VARRICK, THE FRIENDS OF EDDIE COYLE, THE PARALLAX VIEW. I finally got around to watching THREE DAYS OF THE CONDOR and THE TAKING OF PELHAM 123 last year. And Robert Altman’s THE LONG GOOD-BYE, which I didn’t expect to like but ended up enjoying quite a bit.
I’ve got books by Len Deighton, John Le Carré and Eric Ambler gathering dust in my Spy/Espionage section.
Philip K. Dick is an author I always think I SHOULD enjoy, but the few PDK books I’ve read didn’t grab me. I’ll probably try to tackle THE MAN IN THE HIGH CASTLE again one of these days. Asimov’s fiction is not at all my cuppa tea. I do enjoy his jovial introductions to various anthologies, but I’m also disgusted by his history as an unapologetic Giver of Unwanted Hugs and Kisses and Serial Grabber of Bums and Boobs.
Heinlein is very hit-or-miss for me. Clarke’s AGAINST THE FALL OF NIGHT is one that I’ve been meaning to get to.
I’m totally mad at Tolkien’s LORD OF THE RINGS. I’ve tried TWICE to read the damn thing all the way through, and both times I had to throw in the towel somewhere the middle of THE TWO TOWERS. It’s so frustrating because there are undeniably great things in there, vivid scenes and imagery, but I find it an uphill slog to read. The stupidest thing is that I may actually give it one more try someday.
Because of my love for Robert E. Howard’s historical adventure stories (‘The Sowers of the Thunder’, ‘Shadow of the Vulture’, etc) I have a small shelf of stuff by Harold Lamb, Talbot Mundy, Edison Marshall, F. Van Wyck Mason and Henry Treece that have so far resisted being read by me. SWORD AT SUNSET by Rosemary Sutcliff is a well-regarded ‘realistic’ Arthurian novel that I really want to try one of these days.
How many times have I flipped through the listings on Netflix or Prime looking for some acknowledged Film Classic to watch, and instead opt for re-watching an old favorite like THUNDERBALL or PHANTOM OF THE PARADISE or POINT BLANK or JAWS for the gajillionth time? (And Charlie: WEST SIDE STORY is another one of those movies I have seen over and over again and never seem to get tired of).
b.t.
Edo makes a good point differentiating between what you want to read, and what you should read. Generally, I reckon in these days of cultural saturation so much is easily accessible that if you haven't seen or read something yet thats been on your to do list for a while its more likely to fall in the second category.
Coronavirus lockdown is pretty good for making time to tackle books that you know will take a bit of effort to get the most out of. I finally got round to Life And Fate by Vasily Grossman, a big thick novel about... well, life and fate, centered on the seige of Stalingrad by someone who was there. Awesome.
Not sure how long it would have taken me to get round to without the lockdown though.
Btw Edo, the Gormenghast books are well worth your time. You could always cheat a bit, and check out the BBC tv adaptation thats in full on Youtube... but don't let it put you off!
And Charlie, you dodged a bullet with Dune. Seeing as you're into psychedelic mushrooms, watch the documentary about Alejandro Jodorowsky trying to make a film out of the book instead -
www.youtube.com/watch?v=AfJi2sfduqk
-sean
Sean, Edo's mention of Gormenghast made me think of the BBC adaptation too. I'd never previously heard of Gormenghast but I did watch the TV series.
Colin- fine topic! And fine responses, all!
To answer your question- like some of you, my lists would be long. In the case of books, I've tried in recent years to start delving into some classics. On my 'goal list' is anything by Poe. Also Dickens. Also Vonnegut. And oh, so many more. Should have started this years ago.
As for film- again, so many I need/want to experience. Especially dramas from the 60's and 70's. Also- over the holidays I enjoyed a rare evening with a friend and his family. His two daughters are engrossed by anime. I'd never watched any, but watched one with them. Found it quite appealing, actually. So more of that genre would be worth looking into.
B.t.- I fully sympathize with your viewing choices. Somehow, every time "Jaws" or "Thunderball" turns up on screen I just have to watch. Just saw 'T-ball' a month ago. Worth watching just to listen to John Barry's glorious soundtrack...
Welp, b.t. beat me to the tape with his brave confession in his seventh paragraph. It was also my intent to come clean on never having finished the LotR trilogy after three attempts. Midway through TWO TOWERS was also my Waterloo. I truly, truly do not enjoy Tolkien's writing-- it simply doesn't resonate with me or spark my imaginative fancy. The Jackson films honestly had the same effect on my wife and I-- we could not take them seriously. I recognize this could be blasphemous to LOTS o' folks in this circle, so I'll accept any backlash graciously. . .
Like edo, I have always been a person who reads for enjoyment and entertainment, and rarely for enlightenment and education. I. . . am kinda intellectually lazy, I fear. So if I'm not enjoying a book to some degree-- or at least sucked into its plot and world-- I will consciously choose to set it aside. OF HUMAN BONDAGE? Maybe 80 or 90 pages in, and I set it down for good. I plowed all the way through Fitzgerald's TENDER IS THE NIGHT and was furious I wasted my time on these utterly selfish, self-absorbed, overly-entitled parasites on society. So-- I've never read THE GREAT GATSBY as a result. Started both Treasure Island and OLiver Twist as a youngster--- never finished either. And mind you-- I was a READER, big-time.
Ah, here's a more contemporary television-based response: I've never watched a moment of GAME OF THRONES. . . It's like I'm from a different planet!
HB
HB, you don't like Lord Of The Rings?!? Good for you! And b.t.
Elfs, dwarves, #%@$& hobbits - can't stand fantasy books about fuzzy little people and whatnot.
And Tolkein is a terrible writer. Some people say, "ah, but he created his own runic languages", to which I say - so what? Who wants to learn a whole new language for books that are already bad enough in English?
I'd rather even read Robert E Howard again than give Lord Of The Rings another go..
-sean
Selenarch's citing of Street Cred amongst those hardened, ruthless Academic-type toughs conjures its own little hilarious diversion of colliding stereotypes. . . it keeps making me chuckle out loud when I consider it. . .
And- ha!- Sean, looks like we struck a long-covered nerve on the Tolkien front, eh? Mind you, I would never go so far as to condemn LotR or dismiss it out of hand-- because there's just no question that it has had an enormous and heartfelt impact on millions and millions of fans. It deeply and profoundly speaks to a TON of folks in a wide variety of circles I frequent-- so I do have to respect that and give it its due. [Hunh-- it's not unlike treating different Faith traditions from one's own with respect and deference, even when one doesn't hold a shred of those same beliefs-- It never occurred to me that Fandoms would be well-served to behave the same way. . . But boy, would they--!]. At the same time, tho, I have to maintain that it don't work fer me, nope.
It did once, though. I believe I read the Hobbit twice in 7th/8th grades-- and LOVED it. I finally picked it up again about 10 years ago, and could not recognize what it was that grabbed me so tightly. And that's definitely the better book/story. . .
Hey, anyone here ever manage to finish MOBY DICK-? I got about 40% of the way through it several years ago, then got overwhelmed by schedule, and never picked it back up. I mean, I KNOW how it ends, of course-- but it's sort of the epitome of hefty required-reading books that lots of folks manage to skirt around actually reading. . .
HB
HB - I think we need a post on "great books I could never finish" LOL!
E.g., I could add my 3 attempts at Dickens's Great Expectations!
And don't get me started on not being able to finish "Why does E = MC2"!!! I've tried it, and numerous other books on the subject, and just keep getting stuck on Chapter 4 where space (X, Y, and Z) are merged into one axis and time on the other axis, and they start drawing hyperbolas, lol! And of course, each book swears you only need a high school's education in math.
Any book that is ‘Required Reading’ is automatically suspect. In college I had to read the novel BURR by Gore Vidal and though I could appreciate how well written it was, the fact that I HAD to read it for my Poli-Sci class made not want to. Especially on top of all the other reading I had to for my other classes. I ended up having to skim it just to get it over with. Decades later I picked it up again on a whim and enjoyed it thoroughly.
b.t.
Great topic today!
I do think that the distinction between 'want to read' and 'must read' is a valid point. Personally, I'm in the 'want to read' camp' all the way - my experience is that I enjoy a book a lot more when I want to read it; if it's a 'must read' book but I'm not into it then it becomes a slog and I generally stop reading it.
I'm a big fan of the LOTR (both books and movies), read the books when I was a little kid, so I'm a lifelong fan. However, I do acknowledge that it's not everyone's cup of tea, and honestly it's OK if you don't like it. Not every novel, whether classic or new, will be to everyone's liking.
HB, ol' buddy yeah I have finished Moby Dick. While I wouldn't call it one of my favourites, I definitely would recommend it to a new reader. Its themes of the destructive power of obsession is timeless, which is why it's a classic. In fact, one of the best Star Trek movies, Wrath of Khan, follows a similar theme as I recall.
HB, I've watched a few episodes of Game of Thrones, spoiler alert - not all of them. I think the later seasons suffered from not having good source material, specifically the novels which George RR Martin had not written as yet.
As for movies, man, there's so many, I'll leave that for another day!
- Mike 'there's no bad books, only bad writing' from Trinidad & Tobago.
I finished Moby Dick!
Admittedly it was the version by Bill Sienkiewicz...
-sean
HB, I too tried but failed to read the LOTR trilogy around the time when the films came out but, like you, I quite enjoyed The Hobbit (when I was 8). By the way, BBC Radio 4 has a weekly show called In Our Time which discusses a different topic every week and last week's episode was devoted to F. Scott Fitzgerald's The Great Gatsby.
Here are some books I've finally got around to reading over the last few years (a mixture of e-books and real books):
Dracula - Bram Stoker
Frankenstein - Mary Shelley
Planet Of The Apes - Pierre Boulle
On The Road - Jack Kerouac
To Kill A Mockingbird - Harper Lee
A Christmas Carol - Charles Dickens
The Odyssey - Homer
Lady Chatterley's Lover - D H Lawrence
Murder On The Orient Express - Agatha Christie
The Left Hand Of Darkness - Ursula Le Guin
The Haunting Of Hill House - Shirley Jackson
Black Narcissus - Rumer Godden
All the Conan, King Kull and Solomon Kane stories - Robert E. Howard
And all of H P Lovecraft's stories.
Thanks for all the comments!
Colin and HB: I too read THE HOBBIT before flaming out on LOTR. We should start a club!
My girlfriend at the time was really into Tolkien, and passive-aggressively got me to try his books. HOBBIT was enjoyable enough. But then when I started on FELLOWSHIP OF THE RING, hoooo boy. Got bogged down almost immediately. I’m trudging along with the gang as they begin their arduous journey (on foot!) amid huge clunky paragraphs describing the landscape and the weather and what kind of biscuits they’re having for breakfast — and then I realize I’m only a hundred pages in, and I’ve got 300 more to go — in just the FIRST book — and I want to throw myself into the fiery maw of Mount Doom.
And here’s how truly shallow I am. Not only were the individual LOTR books pretty hefty (150 page Doc Savage novels were more my speed), but the covers of the editions I read back then had these really awful watercolor landscapes by Tolkien himself on them, that did absolutely NOTHING to fire the imagination and make you want to keep reading. I know it’s a bad thing to judge a book by its cover, but for Pete’s sake, an appealing, evocative illustration on the cover doesn’t HURT.
b.t.
b.t. - I think we all like a good cover on a book, don't we? I know I do!
As we're also talking about films I'll mention that I watched the first film in the LOTR trilogy but I had no interest in seeing the remaining two. And I watched the first Hobbit film but again I didn't bother with the next two (and The Hobbit book was stretched into 3 movies, each of 3 hours duration!!!)
Sean, I'm sure the Gormenghast books are good - it's not like I've been avoiding them, I just never had the time to pick them up.
As for some of the other stuff mentioned upthread: HB, I actually quite liked Of Human Bondage, but I'll acknowledge that it's a very long, dense book and requires a bit of a time commitment (I read it during a summer vacation years ago when I was doing nothing but spending every day sitting on a terrace of a rental cottage on the Dalmatian coast and reading books. Heaven. That one took me two days to get through.)
I agree about Fitzgerald, though - I first read The Great Gatsby, which is shorter, and never bothered with anything else by him, like Tender is the Night.
I've read damn near everything by Philip Dick, he's one of my favorite writers. However, I fully acknowledge that his last few novels are a bit too philosophical - and a bit navel-gazey at places - and can easily be avoided if you're not committed to reading everything by him. Man in the High Castle is a really good alternate history, though. Otherwise, I find all of his stuff from the 1950s and 1960s really easy to read, just like pulp fiction.
As for Tolkien and LOTR, there was a time, about 2 decades ago, when I would have been aghast at all of this dissing, but now I understand it. I've read LOTR five times, and with the exception of the second time (when I was a teenager), I liked it a little less each time I re-read it. So much of it is, quite frankly, rather dry and boring. However, I still like The Hobbit quite a bit, as well as his fairy tale spoof Farmer Giles of Ham. I think as a writer Tolkien was at his best when he wasn't taking himself to seriously, as he had a pretty good sense of humor. Those posthumously published books like Mister Bliss and Roverandum, which he put together for his sons when they were small children, are similarly funny and enjoyable.
And I really like those water-color paintings he did of Middle Earth. The edition of The Hobbit that I own now has color plates with those paintings in it.
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